What Level do you watch WWE on?

I'm definitely a smark. While I know it's fake, I always love it when WWE makes me mark out. It's hard to explain how I watch it because I don't want anything else like it. TV Shows, Movies & Animated Comedy all sit differently with me than wrestling.

I sort of view it as a sport, but I also view it as ... I guess a soap for men would be the best way to describe it.

I know its fake and don't try to lie to myself, I enjoy it because it's fake. If it were real it would suck. It'd be MMA.

I watched Face/Off for the first time in years on Saturday night, and I'd totally forgotten how it ends. I knew that in the end Travolta would get his face back, that didn't ruin the film for me. I liked how helpless he was when he was in jail and no one knew who he was. That was great stuff. Well, except that he was Nicholas Cage, that was unfortunate, but generally I knew where the film was going and that didn't matter. It's the same as knowing Undertaker will win at WrestleMania. It doesn't make the story any less interesting, or the match any less fun.

It's not like knowing how things work makes them less enjoyable. You just have more things to nitpick at, and more criticisms to make. It also gives you more appreciation when everything is done right. The Punk, Heyman and Lesnar segment on Raw last week was awesome. It was great on the night and set up a storyline that I really want to see. Being fake is a benefit.

I have it on on Mondays in the BG as I am doing other stuff. I actually don't watch the matches as much except for the wrestlers that I consider the 'best.' If a shaemus-type is in a match, i usually either ignore it, or pause it & then ff my dvr past his match to the end.

I read Smackdown spoilers, and then don't watch - 'we gonna have a TAG team match for the main event' every week.

wwe style wrestling is safer for the wrestlers, but i wish there was some middle ground between the boring-but-can-end-at-any-moment style of mma, and the '7-signature-moves-every-frikin-week/the-match-can-only-end-with-a-finisher] style of wwe. I know that Japan often has 'out of nowhere' finishes in some feds... o well.

SERIOUSLY. How many times will someone be dumb enough to set Orton up for that middle-rope ddt? Anyway...

I only really watch PPVs these days and I can generally enjoy it. I don't even try to believe its real as I don't think its possible.

I'm fine with most matches tho, but I can't stand people like Rey. Its the whole set up for the 619 that gets me. Moves like that ruin my enjoyment as its so obviously set up and no one ever falls onto the middle rope like that in other matches. Things like that ruin it for me.

There should be a topic: Top 10 most ridiculous setup for moves:

1. Orton's 25 minute dancing and hooting and gesturing before a normal RKO kills it for me.
2. Falling on the ropes for the 619
3. The setup to Orton's middle-rope ddt.
4. The 45 minute down time between the spinbuster and the dropping of the people's elbow.
etc

I really REALLY am trying but I can't help but feel jaded. When I first started watching it was like 95/96 era and then came the Monday Night Wars, so I really can't stand this PG bullshit. Match outcomes are crazy predictable and I can see the same storylines developing day in and day out with some differences if I'm lucky.

These guys just aren't half as good as what I grew up watching. I'm jaded I admit it, but it is what is it

I'm with you. I with they went more toward realism - not necessarily 'attitude'- but maybe weight classes, and the removal of dumb-ass moves, and maybe some non-finisher, non-rollup finishes. Maybe not the same 6 guys winning every match. Shaemus has 100 wins in 2013 already (source LOP).

And I absolutely HATE when someone takes the advantage, punches the guy 10 times, then, for no reason, walks away and takes a break from beating upo the guy, like hitting the guy is too tiring for him to continue.

oh, shaemus' 10 chest battering forearms should make the lsit as well... just sit there and let hme smack you because you are held there by what? the ropes?

I'm fine with most matches tho, but I can't stand people like Rey. Its the whole set up for the 619 that gets me. Moves like that ruin my enjoyment as its so obviously set up and no one ever falls onto the middle rope like that in other matches. Things like that ruin it for me.

Mysterio is trying to set them up that way, because that's how he hits his finish. He does a drop toe hold, dropkick or 'rana into the ropes. Jericho does it too, to set up the running knee strike. Christian does as well actually, to do the standing on the back choke deal. Henry and Del Rio occasionally set guys up on the middle for the slide down the back to the outside.

oh, shaemus' 10 chest battering forearms should make the lsit as well... just sit there and let hme smack you because you are held there by what? the ropes?

By his other arm.

a gentle hand on the chin is not going to hold a 240 lb man in place. if Zig chooses to move one of his arms up off the ropes, he falls out of the 'hold.'

a gentle hand on the chin is not going to hold a 240 lb man in place. if Zig chooses to move one of his arms up off the ropes, he falls out of the 'hold.'

What makes you think it's gentle?

I can suspend disbelief enough to enjoy the storylines to a point. If they ever did another Katie Vick story, I would just shake my head and say something about the writers. As a long time smark, it's hard to separate the two completely. I understand it's not as real as MMA (which is fucking awesome chux) but it's not completely fake either. I appreciate everything they are trying to do and respect it.

I can suspend disbelief enough to enjoy the storylines to a point. If they ever did another Katie Vick story, I would just shake my head and say something about the writers. As a long time smark, it's hard to separate the two completely. I understand it's not as real as MMA (which is fucking awesome chux) but it's not completely fake either. I appreciate everything they are trying to do and respect it.

In what way is MMA awesome? It's so incredibly dull. I could really enjoy an MMA highlight package, or even a select few matches if I was told they were especially good, but a whole show is a chore to sit through.

sometimes mma IS a chore to watch. It's up to the promoters to book interesting matches. The wrestlers make for boring matches if his opponent isn't good at defending it. in mma, though, a match could be 10 seconds and be awesome, or it could be 25 minutes and be awesome. Both the matches could be stinkers to, though. It's NOT knowing what's going to happen that is the exciting part. in wrestling, everything is pre-determined (which i have no problem with), but when it is SO INCREDIBLY PREDICTABLY predetermined, that it gets bad.

When was the last time you saw a PPV and didn't 'guess' 90% of the winners correctly.

henry v cena. please.
shield v usos. c'mon man
whc mitb (knew sandow was gonna take it)
wwe title mitb (orton was my #2 choice)
del rio vs ziggy. didn't see zig losing.

mma... you can guess a winner, but mostly the bookers choose guys who are evenly matched, and even so, every once in a while, anderson silva gets cocked and then gets KNOCKED THE FUCK OUT!

Last edited by theonetruemichael (Mon-22-Jul-2013 21:49:35)

I don't want wrestling to be realistic, I know it's fake so I want to see crazy unbelievable moves. I love a good spot fest.

I read the results to raw most weeks then watch what looks worthy of watching. I don't remember the last time I've watched Raw from the beginning tot he end. I do it with PPVs too , I still have an interest but I don't care about it enough.

But to answer your question. I see soap operas and sit-coms as exaggerations of everyday life, that's the same way I look at wrestling. As an exaggeration of a contact sport. You see how boxers and stuff hype up fights by saying shit about the other fighter? That's a simplified version of the basis of feuds and storylines.

If I went into saying this is fake but cool, I wouldn't like it. So I watch basically by enjoying such things as acting ability (selling/playing a gimmick well *Looking at you Mr. Wyatt.*), technical ability, how good a power move looks, etc. I watch wrestling like a critic watches a movie. Completly in the moment and suspending belief but still paying attention to the little things to critique it. Most of the time I don't even bother with explaining or reviewing shows anymore it is just for my own enjoyment.

sometimes mma IS a chore to watch. It's up to the promoters to book interesting matches. The wrestlers make for boring matches if his opponent isn't good at defending it. in mma, though, a match could be 10 seconds and be awesome, or it could be 25 minutes and be awesome. Both the matches could be stinkers to, though. It's NOT knowing what's going to happen that is the exciting part. in wrestling, everything is pre-determined (which i have no problem with), but when it is SO INCREDIBLY PREDICTABLY predetermined, that it gets bad.

I know what you're saying, but I'm not sure. Sometimes predictable can be good. Unpredictable for the sake of unpredictable gives us Vince Russo. Sometimes you know what will happen in a good story, it doesn't mean the story isn't good.

As for MMA, I don't find it exciting to not know whether or not a fight will be any good, especially if I go into it thinking the match could be fun. I don't then go "Wow, it sucked! Awesome!" The best I can hope for is a good fight, and the worst that can happen is a bad one. It's just like any other sport. Problem is, in my experience it has a lower hit rate. Like you said though, it's awesome when something like the Silva knockout happens, that almost makes it worth it. Almost.

I can suspend disbelief enough to enjoy the storylines to a point. If they ever did another Katie Vick story, I would just shake my head and say something about the writers. As a long time smark, it's hard to separate the two completely. I understand it's not as real as MMA (which is fucking awesome chux) but it's not completely fake either. I appreciate everything they are trying to do and respect it.

In what way is MMA awesome? It's so incredibly dull. I could really enjoy an MMA highlight package, or even a select few matches if I was told they were especially good, but a whole show is a chore to sit through.

It sounds like you don't understand or appreciate the strategic aspects of the sport which is why you would enjoy a highlight package. It's not about huge knockouts all the time. I love a great ground battle. Watching guard passes and reversals is great if you understand what they are doing. Uneducated fans will look at a ground battle and just say something stupid like "that's just two dudes dry humping each other" and if you don't understand what they are doing, I guess I can see why it looks like that but when you do understand, it's art. Seeing the clash of styles and how they are going to combat their opponents strengths when it is their weakness. It's not completely style vs. style anymore because everyone trains every aspect. Some guys are better at one art than they are the others and that can make for dull fights every now and then. Not every fight is going to be a great one and that is to be expected in something that doesn't have a predetermined outcome. The promoters can't help that. Some just guys aren't willing to take that risk and they fight to win rounds and not to finish the fight. Some guys have gone on a run through the lower ranked guys and he looked great doing it but when he gets to the top guys, he gets murdered. It's just like any other sport in that aspect. I get there are just some things you can't get into but I am a firm believer that if you get educated on it, you will be able to make a better decision on if you like it or not. I just have a problem with people who don't understand it saying it sucks when they have no idea what they are watching.

mma's problem (in getting wrestling fans to like it) is that the fighters fight to win, not entertain. It easier to entertain when in wrestling 'the match itself' is the product and wins and losses mean almost nothing. In mma, wins and losses are EVERYTHING to the fighters. Also, the mma guys fight MAYBE 2-3 times a year. Wrestlers fight 2+ times a WEEK.

Its difficult for mma, cuz even the live crowds boo the ground game. honestly, while I appreciate the skill and techniques of the ground game, it can be boring to watch at times.

but mma is usually incredible to watch. even the boring ones.

Undertaker has gone on record in saying that if mma was a viable career 20 years ago, there would be no undertaker. he would have gone into mma.

mma's problem (in getting wrestling fans to like it) is that the fighters fight to win, not entertain. It easier to entertain when in wrestling 'the match itself' is the product and wins and losses mean almost nothing. In mma, wins and losses are EVERYTHING to the fighters. Also, the mma guys fight MAYBE 2-3 times a year. Wrestlers fight 2+ times a WEEK.

And this is where people get it twisted. You seem to understand. Fighters are not entertainers. They are fighters. The low end is usually 2 fights and I have seen some guys fight 4-5 times a year. I would never discount the toughness of pr wrestlers but they are not trained fighters and the two businesses are not the same. They share some similarities but they are clearly different sports. There are some guys like Chael Sonnen who has embraced the entertainment aspect of all competition and he's started cutting promos and it does get people behind him and want to see him fight or hear him talk but most guys are the classic "I respect my opponent and I'll let my skills do the talking" type guys. Dana White doesn't press guys to do one or the other but he lets it be known that if the fans want to see a guy fight, he will put that guy on more cards rather than a guy of equal skill that the fans are luke warm about. It is a business in the end.

I can suspend disbelief enough to enjoy the storylines to a point. If they ever did another Katie Vick story, I would just shake my head and say something about the writers. As a long time smark, it's hard to separate the two completely. I understand it's not as real as MMA (which is fucking awesome chux) but it's not completely fake either. I appreciate everything they are trying to do and respect it.

In what way is MMA awesome? It's so incredibly dull. I could really enjoy an MMA highlight package, or even a select few matches if I was told they were especially good, but a whole show is a chore to sit through.

It sounds like you don't understand or appreciate the strategic aspects of the sport which is why you would enjoy a highlight package. It's not about huge knockouts all the time. I love a great ground battle. Watching guard passes and reversals is great if you understand what they are doing. Uneducated fans will look at a ground battle and just say something stupid like "that's just two dudes dry humping each other" and if you don't understand what they are doing, I guess I can see why it looks like that but when you do understand, it's art. Seeing the clash of styles and how they are going to combat their opponents strengths when it is their weakness. It's not completely style vs. style anymore because everyone trains every aspect. Some guys are better at one art than they are the others and that can make for dull fights every now and then. Not every fight is going to be a great one and that is to be expected in something that doesn't have a predetermined outcome. The promoters can't help that. Some just guys aren't willing to take that risk and they fight to win rounds and not to finish the fight. Some guys have gone on a run through the lower ranked guys and he looked great doing it but when he gets to the top guys, he gets murdered. It's just like any other sport in that aspect. I get there are just some things you can't get into but I am a firm believer that if you get educated on it, you will be able to make a better decision on if you like it or not. I just have a problem with people who don't understand it saying it sucks when they have no idea what they are watching.

I do know what's going on, I understand it. I've watched a lot of MMA and for the most part it bores me. So does baseball though, it's not like I'm picking out MMA as being especially dull. I'd take an average MMA match over the best ice hockey offers.

What's your beef with hockey????

lack of teeth.

Last edited by theonetruemichael (Tue-23-Jul-2013 22:08:58)

Can't see the puck.

lack of teeth.

And this is a bad thing?????

Can't see the puck

My God, you sound like my grandmother......Its black on white ice!!!!!!